[Hit_Apex]

Originally Posted by KevinM

Maybe. Okay, yes. But aside than the fact that BMW could use a MT than can handle increased torque, there are a lot of BMW enthusiasts who are happy with < 450 lb-ft and want the involvement of a MT. I am fully aware that in the near future this will be available in the used car market only (with a premium for the MT). Which is why I'm keeping my 2002 M5, 2007 Z4M coupe and 2020 M2C for the foreseeable future.

And which one would that be? If ZF or Magna (Getrag), etc had a suitable box BMW would have used it on the G8x already. None of these companies have invested in MT R&D for several years. So, BMW have to justify the R&D cost plus the emission penalty to their line - just doesn't make sense. We can pipe dream though...

[KoenG]

Originally Posted by Rafichicago

We own F90 M5 and i like many things about it over G80 M3 however if it comes to performance differences are marginal even between those 2. With modern cars difference is smaller then its ever been. IMO no replacement for displacement saying is less and less true. Especially with modern cars curb weight getting to ridiculous levels. Hp per tonne tells more about what to expect with modern car’s performance.

Ok, you keep referring to performance, but that's another thing. Nobody ever stated that small engines can't be stronger than big ones. Remind the F1 M12/13 engine of 1.5l with 1400hp in 1986? I presume we don't want that engine in our daily driver because it drives like.... crap.

[BimmerMan33]

BMW is definitely not investing R&D to improve manual transmissions. They’ll keep using the present ZF manual and keep decreasing manual options, I feel that only the M2 will be left with a manual option eventually.
Current M3/M4s already feel like e39 M5 successor in terms of size & feel..
Given that ICE has to keep up with progressively stringent emission laws, adding more complexities also make a manual transmission less enjoyable.. Rev hang.. is an issue in most current manual trans cars. Turbo lag is more pronounced in manual trans cars..
M cars have turbos tuned to provide more boost in mid to high rpm’s, so city driving in manual M cars feels less fun..
It’s getting difficult to have a manual trans car that’s actually more fun practically than on paper.. is it because manufacturers are not willing to spend additional R&D to make it work smoothly with the current ICE with complexities for a not so high take rate or it’s just difficult to make it happen from an engineering persective as automatic trans is easier to integrate with electronics..

Just my thoughts..