[Artemis]

Verstappen got handed a 5-sec time penalty by the race stewards. Johnny Herbert was no part of them. Verstappen and Piastri gave their views. Red Bull Racing didn't request for a review (imagine race stewards considering: "Actually, from hindsight, our 5-second clemency (a 5-second penalty instead of a 10-second penalty) + no penalty points was mild.".

So that's settled. Now let's move on to Miami.

And let's not be surprised if Verstappen forces Piastri off-track in a future race, referring to the Jeddah 2025 lap 1 incident.

[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by dfox

RedBull made the right decision to force the stewards to make the decision. Giving the place back would have obviously given up the place, whereas if they were to have been able to play their cards better, they could have had Max more than 5 seconds ahead and the penalty would have meant nothing. Max has done that before. "Send them my regards". But Piastri is too fast, it obviously didn't work.

The penalty was appropriate. Piastri was very clearly ahead. Max only came alongside because he divebombed on the outside. Something he wouldn't have done if there were a gravel pit or wall there, he would have needed to yield the place to Piastri or risk a crash. But he didn't, he overtook by running off the track, deserving of a penalty.

Lawson received a 10 second penalty for a similar problem. He went too hard into turn 1 and couldn't keep it on track for turn 2, so he got a 10 second penalty despite being clearly ahead at turn 1.

Dirty tricks getting cleaned up. I like it.

I'd like to see F1 put in more gravel or grass to make this issue a moot point.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Killed by Death

I'd like to see F1 put in more gravel or grass to make this issue a moot point.

Verstappen pleaded for this months ago. But he added that he realizes that it's complicated because several circuits are also used for MotoGP. For safety reasons, can't include too many treacherous circuit layouts. He suggested to work out a compromise.

[Killed by Death]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Verstappen pleaded for this months ago. But he added that he realizes that it's complicated because several circuits are also used for MotoGP. For safety reasons, can't include too many treacherous circuit layouts. He suggested to work out a compromise.

I'm sure any engineer with half a brain could figure something out.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Artemis

And let's not be surprised if Verstappen forces Piastri off-track in a future race, referring to the Jeddah 2025 lap 1 incident.

forces off track? nah I'm expecting he's thinking something more effective ...

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Killed by Death

I'm sure any engineer with half a brain could figure something out.

like tyre stacks?

[leaveamarc]

Red Bull looking better this weekend, wish we could see more of Yuki in the car

[GuidoK]

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by G30M

forces off track? nah I'm expecting he's thinking something more effective ...

I am 100% expecting Max to be ultra aggressive next time and either squeeze Pia into a wall or flat out see a collision. It will serve Max well to ensure Pia knows to yield next time especially if the WDC points are close. I think this incident will be like when Per crashed on Monaco - Max won’t forget and will get the better of him going forward.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

I am 100% expecting Max to be ultra aggressive next time and either squeeze Pia into a wall or flat out see a collision. It will serve Max well to ensure Pia knows to yield next time especially if the WDC points are close. I think this incident will be like when Per crashed on Monaco - Max won’t forget and will get the better of him going forward.

the stewards will have a ball dishing out penalties. but on a more serious note, i know he is smart enough not to ruin his WDC. if he keeps chipping at the points and the papaya cars trip over each other that gives him a good chance.

in Saudi he was upset because RB asked FIA if a certain scenario happened in lap 1 if he'd be penalised, and i think they told him no, so he did it to find the outcome was not what he expected. that's just what i read.

[G30M]

George Russell is hinted in an interview that he can't get a contract in Merc because Toto is chasing Max. also rumours George has been speaking to Horner to get a drive in case Max goes to Merc.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by G30M

George Russell is hinted in an interview that he can't get a contract in Merc because Toto is chasing Max. also rumours George has been speaking to Horner to get a drive in case Max goes to Merc.

That's old news...

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by G30M

forces off track? nah I'm expecting he's thinking something more effective ...

My personal take on the Verstappen-Piastri encounter during the past Jeddah GP ? I was watching the GP live, saw Piastri (P2) reeling in Verstappen (P1), expected Piastri to go for the kill instead of backing down/off, saw Verstappen doing the geometry thing that Hamilton did during the 2021 Abu Dhabi first lap and I considered straightaway that Verstappen 'd better invert track positions with Piastri at a strategic spot to avoid race stewards possibly imposing a time penalty.

Regarding the pictured Verstappen-Hamilton incident: it requires some context for better understanding. For the record: as you recall, that happened during the 2021 Monza GP (Sep 12, 2021). During lap 25 Hamilton aggressively protected his track position when Verstappen aggressively approached. Neither driver was prepared to yield - no favors. They crashed & DNF'd. Race stewards ruled both Hamilton and Verstappen at fault for the incident, albeit with Verstappen being "predominantly" at fault. Apart from blaming Verstappen (major part of the blame), the race stewards equally considered that Hamilton "was driving an avoiding line, although his position caused [Verstappen] to go onto the kerb" (that may sound like an euphemism for "Hamilton forced Verstappen almost off track") and that Hamilton "could have steered further from the kerb to avoid the accident".



During the 2025 Jeddah race, Verstappen aggressively protected his track position when Piastri with a faster McLaren aggressively approached and got alongside of him. Again, neither driver seemed to be prepared to yield. No favors either here. Verstappen ultimately took evasive action to avoid a crash, possible DNF and more penalty points putting him at risk of a 12-penalty points race ban.

Verstappen is known to be vindictive if he feels screwed or crossed (regardless what race stewards decide and what teams tell him) - he got the reputation to be quite firm about this and doesn't forget. Verstappen may consider that there is a bill to be settled with Piastri - some unfinished business. Therefore, I expect Verstappen to strike his vengeance upon Piastri in a future race whenever it rises to the occasion: a Verstappen-Piastri incident will happen. Just a matter of time - when it happens, you will remember this post. For example, if Verstappen's start grid position is ahead of Piastri during a future race start, expect Verstappen to aggressively steer 45° or more into Piastri's direction to force him to either brake or crash + Verstappen claiming that he "defended his start grid position". Piastri should anticipate this type of action prior to a race, to get around Verstappen, or ensure that he's outqualifying Verstappen during the qualies. And if during a race they both approach a corner alongside each other, Verstappen will not take evasive action this time around.

Trouble is ahead. "La vengeance est un plat qui se mange froid".

Condone any such behavior ? No. Some of the best F1 drivers can act erratically.

Nelson Piquet went into Kung-Fu mode with Chilean driver Salazar during the 1982 German GP (Hockenheim) after an unlapping incident (video: see here).

After the 1993 Japanese GP (Suzuka) and press conference, Senna punched Irvine (he hit him on the temple and pushed him off the massage table) because of unlapping followed by holding Senna up as backmarker. Senna still won the GP but fumed. Senna got a 2-race ban for his physical violence and told the press later that his violence was unacceptable (but still blaming Irvine for what he had done on track). Rumor has it that Irvine jokingly shouted "Insurance claim!" after he got punched by Senna (video of a pissed off Senna: here)

Verstappen hit and pushed Ocon after the 2018 Brazilian GP after they collided (Ocon tried to unlap himself at the expense of race leader Verstappen - it cost Verstappen the race victory) (video: here).

Russell 'slapped' Bottas during the 2021 Italian GP (Imola) after they collided (video: here).

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Verstappen is known to be vindictive if he feels screwed or crossed (regardless what race stewards decide and what teams tell him) - he's got the reputation to be quite firm about this and doesn't forget.

but NOT when he knows he's wrong.

he plays by whatever rules the stewards come up with. if there is no rule (back in the day when he was newer to F1) he pushed the limits. FIA created rule after rule to clarify such limits. i read somewhere RB had a QA meeting with FIA (possibly during the wider team briefing) about a certain scenario and he was unhappy that the outcome wasn't what he was told at the brief. his anger was not at Oscar but what he believed he was told.

this is not a Perez intentional crash, this was a clean pass and he knows it. if there was a wall there he would not have driven into it, he'd be fighting Russell into T4. or if as you suggested he'd crash into Oscar he would have been heavily penalised.

of course he will race Oscar hard, but he knows the rule book better than anyone else on the paddock, which means he also knows what penalties are applied when.

he has more brains than emotions, unlike what you seem to think.

[minn19]

I personally can’t wait for the Oscar vs Max war from an entertainment standpoint, I hope it doesn’t disappoint. Lando can’t either, might be the only way he wins the WDC this year.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

Obviously I would love to see your prediction come true

LEC drove a very good race in Jeddah. But I think it's very difficult to predict where the Ferrari is competitive and where not.
For sure it's not the car the media wanted us to believe during the winterstop when rumors went rampant.

Finally we have "Audio" (MAX and MBS after Jeddah GP) => https://www.reddit.com/r/formuladank...ter_jeddah_gp/

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by G30M

but NOT when he knows he's wrong.

he plays by whatever rules the stewards come up with. if there is no rule (back in the day when he was newer to F1) he pushed the limits. FIA created rule after rule to clarify such limits. i read somewhere RB had a QA meeting with FIA (possibly during the wider team briefing) about a certain scenario and he was unhappy that the outcome wasn't what he was told at the brief. his anger was not at Oscar but what he believed he was told.
this is not a Perez intentional crash, this was a clean pass and he knows it. if there was a wall there he would not have driven into it, he'd be fighting Russell into T4. or if as you suggested he'd crash into Oscar he would have been heavily penalised.
of course he will race Oscar hard, but he knows the rule book better than anyone else on the paddock, which means he also knows what penalties are applied when.
he has more brains than emotions, unlike what you seem to think.

If he considers that the competitor cannot be blamed, it's OK for him.

But if he considers that he got short-changed, he will strike someday.

His reaction post-race masked anger and frustration (especially because he suggested that he was not allowed to speak his mind). But he also expressed appreciation for Piastri's rise.

"Max Verstappen refuses to explain frustration at Saudi Arabian GP penalty for incident with Oscar Piastri"
https://www.skysports.com/amp/f1/new...-oscar-piastri

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Finally we have "Audio" (MAX and MBS after Jeddah GP) => https://www.reddit.com/r/formuladank...ter_jeddah_gp/

MBS to MV: How dare you to avoid a collision,damage and a ruined race so as to deserve a time penalty from my friends the stewards for being the good guy.

[MoeTE87]

The more I watch the turn 1 incident the more I believe the Stewards got it wrong. As you can see, Oscar had so much real estate to make the turn but still kept driving straight into Max, Max clearly had a wheel head but had to go off because there wasn't anywhere else for him to go. I think for the future and any turn 1 incidents like that..just let them freakin drive. It's either a penalty or not. No half assed penalty.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by MoeTE87

The more I watch the turn 1 incident the more I believe the Stewards got it wrong. As you can see, Oscar had so much real estate to make the turn but still kept driving straight into Max, Max clearly had a wheel head but had to go off because there wasn't anywhere else for him to go. I think for the future and any turn 1 incidents like that..just let them freakin drive. It's either a penalty or not. No half assed penalty.

MAX would have lost badly should he have held his ground with damage to floor and aero and possibly other things from a wheels hit from PIA, such was his forceful turn entry with both his right wheels off the track.

[dfox]

Originally Posted by MoeTE87

The more I watch the turn 1 incident the more I believe the Stewards got it wrong. As you can see, Oscar had so much real estate to make the turn but still kept driving straight into Max, Max clearly had a wheel head but had to go off because there wasn't anywhere else for him to go. I think for the future and any turn 1 incidents like that..just let them freakin drive. It's either a penalty or not. No half assed penalty.

you can watch videos all you want, the telemetry tells the story.

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/a...05398IOGfi0vks

Originally Posted by Jolyon Palmer

Max is actually even quicker on turn one, lap one, with 100 kilos of fuel, no apex, and medium tires, then he was on his qualifying lap the day before on soft tires where he was about to get pole.

Max divebombed and had no intention of making the corner. His plan was to "get ahead" of Piastri at the apex, run off the track, blame Piastri, and then let the Stewards decide. And they did. And Max lost the gamble. We should all just move along with life now... lol.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by Artemis

His reaction post-race masked anger and frustration (especially because he suggested that he was not allowed to speak his mind). But he also expressed appreciation for Piastri's rise.

my understanding is RB got clarification from FIA pre race, and Max planned his move (as you see in videos of past moves which have not been penalized), he made his move and the stewards penalized, so he was angry. don't know what exactly was discussed with the FIA but it's to do with that. Oscar's pass was clean. he was unhappy with something that was discussed between RB and FIA.